Empires rise, And empires fall, Some even burn to the ground. It's the natural order of things. Adapt or die.

just makes the game unrealistic mechs.

actually, it sounds like your not happy where you are because even the slightest change made you unhappy

maybe you should contemplate branching out from just reprocessing mission loot, there's a wide world out there

Currently, that's about the ratio of non-supercap industry, except that it's 99% in hisec, 1% in 0.0

Simply because it's the status quo, you implicitly assume that this situation is "balanced". Of course it's easy to see that it's not by imagining that the ratio is reversed, only this time not in your favour.

Even after the changes Ytterbium has outlined, the very large majority of production will still take place in hi-sec. If you think differently, then by all means show us your analysis. But leave the tinfoil, name-calling and big-lie bullshit out of it please. Just numbers will persuade far more effectively than whining ever will.

So querns already made the point that you don't seem to get how asteroid belts work, so let's attack the rest of your premise. Imagine thescenario. You are a three day old newbie in an alliance well known for loving its newbies. You're looking for something to do, so do you a) start training down a pointless dead end training path (considering you want to pvp) and grab a venture, then go mining for 5m isk/hr? b) Run around behind a veteran looting his ratting sites for what is certainly more than that? c) bug a mentor for a stack of free frigates, have fun PvPing, then say something adorable on voice comms and get showered with more isk than you think you can possibly ever use (really, a couple hundred million) because of it?

Hint: The answer is not A.

And to squash the typical and hilariously wrong response I always see, the answer still does not become A if the person looking to buy the minerals just doubles the price he's willing to pay, because if you need some minerals are you going to a) offer to pay twice the going price just so you can get them locally or b) import them from empire in one of any of the readily available compressed forms?

Hint: The answer is, once again, not A.

Just to cap things off, none of this changes if we're talking about a veteran player, except the activities are more like A) jump into your mackinaw and, realizing you've trained yourself down a dead-end training path, drink yourself into a stupor while mining these "pristine belts" for (at best) about 35m/hr b) run around as the veteran newbies follow around, ratting for a minimum of 60m/hr or c) Go out and have fun PvPing, knowing that if you die, you'll actually make money because of the corp reimbursement policies. Or, d), **** off to FW lowsec on an alt and farm the missions for far more isk/hr than anything you'll do in your own space... but that's a different topic entirely.

Answer? Still not A, sorry.

In case you weren't aware, grav sites (the scanner based mining sites) respawn pretty much instantly if they're fully mined out. In other words, it's not like a lack of ore is why "we can't get enough minerals" - it's got everything to do with mining simply not being a worthwhile task.

I think you should improve your understanding of the phrase "risk versus reward".

The inherent risk that comes with living in nullsec.

This has nothing to do with mining and everything to do with manufacturing. If you're a highsec miner that wants to sell to nullsec, you will now compress the ore directly and it will get shipped to those nice shiny refineries. Thus your product is not disadvantaged at all. The buff to nullsec refining means that there's a reward, not entirely for the risk, but also for the unavoidable costs of doing manufacturing in nullsec. This change basically gives null a better stake in t1 manufacturing.

The more I think about these changes the more awesome I think they are in every way.

Oh Daniel, you don't believe their lies about how null sec belts work either? These guys act like no one can fly out there and see system after system of rocks that have sat for YEARS. They act like the respawn rate of the rocks has anything to do with the fact that they can't be bothered to mine themselves or compel their members to mine for them.

I figure once this new change fails to generate any significant amount of mining in null sec (outside of attempts to manipulate markets of course) that the Goons will just ask CCP to bypass all the other game mechanics that they can't be bothered to use and just put Supercaps directly in their hangars.

How so?

I don't see how this will explicitly affect t1 manufacturing over any other form of manufacturing.

Null sec will be encouraged to localise their production across the board.

Yet it entitles your CSM members to lobby for changes to mechanics that don't even impact "you", all because you refuse to mine belts in your own space. Sounds about par for the course for Goon Logic.

it is arguably more safe in the sense that if you ignore reality you can argue anything

it is not arguably more safe in the sense that there are legitimate arguments it is more safe

"if you put huge amounts of effort into being safer, you can be safer than if I do absolutely nothing to protect myself and indeed play like i'm roleplaying a bot"

we are able, through effort, to make ourselves safer. that amount of effort in highsec would make us much safer than we are now. there is no sense in which null is safer than highsec, your argument is merely that a higher caliber of player exists in nullsec: but these overmen would be a higher caliber anywhere

Highsec you fit up a tanked mack/skiff, go watch a film and let concord do the guarding.

Fly a skiff instead. They can hit 80k EHP, making them impervious to casual ganking. Sure, a concentrated overkill force could still take you down, but that would only happen if you were deliberately being targeted because you were being obnoxious, perhaps in an out of game forum.

The New Order takes on people who are specifically obnoxious to them; people who talk back. You can avoid this by not being obnoxious. The moldy, moth-bitten argument that highsec is less safe than nullsec is studded with the belief that one should not have to fit their ship against disaster; that one is entitled to the best yields simply by being in highsec. If you dissuade against casual ganking by flying a tankable ship, keep your mouth shut, and keep an ear out for the next Burn Jita and/or Hulkageddon, you'll find that your troubles will dwindle to an infinitesimal level.

I see no KB history at all for you.

correct, we should be properly rewarded for the amount of effort we put in
that we put in the effort does not make the effort free and does not entitle a lazy highseccer roleplaying a bot to anywhere close to the same level of reward: to the extent it does the game needs fixing

This is true. They take on whoever they want. Fortunately for anyone with a brain, "whoever they want" are the people who are obnoxious and raise a stink about their entitlements. Don't do that, and surprise -- you have no trouble.

Attempting to take a crowbar and open up these improbable series of events into everyday occurrence is a pretty tired tactic.

https://zkillboard.com/region/10000035/group/543/ <-- Exhumers killed in Deklein
https://zkillboard.com/region/10000035/group/463/ <-- Mining barges killed in Deklein

If what you're saying is true, these numbers should be "zero", instead of "hundreds."

Furthermore, nullsec security is completely manufactured by a playerbase, while highsec security is guaranteed by the server.

Have you ever heard of a logoff trap?

The best way to earn isk from missions is to not loot anything at all and blitz them. This change has zero impact upon the best level 4 income.

Wrong. In the time it takes you do all of that you could have done another 5 missions are earned a lot more in LP.

CCP MAKES BIG ANNOUNCEMENT FOR THE SUMMER, CONTAINING:

• No new ships
• No new play styles
• No new content
• No new reason to play the game

BUT THE INNOVATION DOESN'T STOP THERE!

Oh no. We get to take salvaging and reprocessing--a boring and thankless necessity--and make it 40% more thankless.

Not your brightest move, CCP!

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AvCLlTV8bSxNdEVyU0VndlRMb21ieGx2b2d4eXRWeEE&amp;usp=drive_web#gid=0

Level 3 mission info for blitzing at 50mil/hr. I belive I can improve on that isk/hr.

Level 4 blitzing will easily earn twice as much.

Simple-minded enough to make a dumb rebuttal, I suppose.

I want development energies spent on enhancing the game, not endless and stupid frobnicating with the mechanics.

It is the exact same process. You will not be earning 100 mil/hr from the blocade because there is not 100 mil in there.

You do not get back to back blocades, missions are randomised so no, what you are suggesting cannot happen.

If you want to specifically target 425mm railguns, target them by modifying the minerals you get out of them. A blanket nerf across all salvage is overkill and unnecessary.

I spent three months of Eve as a dedicated salvager in a salvaging corp, Pro Synergy. Made a career out of it. One of the few careers without any direct incentive or oversight from CCP. I know how much gets reprocessed, and it's a lot. And it's thankless. And it's boring. And now it's a lot worse.

My position is the same: if it needs rebalancing, fine, but spot-fix the problem items, and reduce the overall nerf. That's the right thing to do.

1. The mechanics of missions making it impossible to do what youjust suggested does blow a very wide hole in what you just said.

2. You cannot do back to back blocades for hours, you stand a small chance of getting two, a very very rare chance of three and any higher than that is less likely to happen than officer spawns.

3. You seem to be thinking that blitzing means doing one mission over and over. You are wrong, Blitzing is the process of finishing all missions as quickly as possible.

Saying something to the effect of: "It isn't a nerf to your profession because you can do another profession" isn't a valid rebuttal.

This isn't about Pro Synergy anyway. It's about an severe nerf to an entire profession as an unintentional side-effect of efforts to fix something else entirely. Hell, salvaging is presented as a career option in the tutorial missions. Did CCP forget that?

don't worry this is probably why the goonies think Anoms are inferior to level 4 missions.

You mean where you told a lie about making 100 mil/hr in the blocade despite the fact that there in not 100 mil isk in that mission?

Now quote the part where I told you I can get 100 mil in the time it takes you run a single blockade by blitzing.

You are only limited by what you are afraid to lose. My Battleship is just as vulnerable to a gank in HS or LS mission as you are in NS. You can pretend it isn't but we all know if you want to ganl something in HS you can gank it at reasonable cost. But lets keep pretending its about "risk"

You fly weaker ships and absorb less income because you choose to, not because mechanics force you to.

Except you can take more precautions in protecting yourself in 0.0. Where as those who mission in HS are limited to knowing that after they die concord will bounce some dudes into their pods. Protecting yourself in 0.0 isn't difficult. Especially when you are talking about playing deep in your own space. All the same tools as HS, plus bubbles, cynos and the ability to shoot first.

You are only limited to what you are willing to lose. Anywhere in EVE. Game mechanics have nothing to do with personal risk aversion.

But we do. You can look up the LP rewards, you can easily find all of the mission guides we use to know exactly what to shoot or do to finish a 30 min mission in under 5 min.

You simply do not run missions effectively or know how to.

The triggers in the blockade are not random.

Realistic time is indeed 5 min

I leave my LP sitting for 1-2 weeks or longer depending on what the markets are doing and make my trips in a 14au/sec blockade runner.

The Blockade, level 4

Faction: Serpentis

Initial Group
1x Core Port Admiral Trigger

Spawn 1
1x Core Vice Admiral Trigger


Spawn 2
1x Core Vice Admiral Trigger

Spawn 3
1x Core Rear Admiral Trigger

Spawn 4
1x Core Lord Admiral

Mission finished.

Your finished, report back to your agent for your reward and get another mission.

No thats the order you go.

You can ignore everything else.